This interview with Anthony Mandler covers his extensive career in visual arts, starting with his late entry into music video directing at 32 and feature films at 42. He emphasizes the importance of building genuine relationships with artists, recounting how he earned the trust of Rihanna and Jay-Z to create iconic music videos. Mandler details his transition from photography to music videos, commercials, and eventually feature films like "Monster" and "Surrounded." He also shares insights into the challenges of navigating industry gatekeepers, maintaining artistic integrity against product placement, and adapting to new technologies like AI in filmmaking. The discussion highlights his belief in the power of curiosity and optimism for career longevity and personal growth, alongside the evolving landscape of media production.
He directed his first movie at 42, viewing his journey as a series of "failures" due to not immediately achieving his goal of being a filmmaker.
He felt immense gratitude for his success in photography and music videos but was frustrated by the short, 3-minute format of music videos, desiring more time to tell stories and develop characters.
Mandler notes the industry's tendency to categorize people (e.g., "hip-hop director" vs. "rock director").
He learned dexterity through photography, shooting diverse subjects like women, men, bands, and scientists, which prepared him to handle various styles in music videos.
To achieve longevity, he emphasizes adapting and demonstrating versatile skills rather than staying in one "box."
Building Relationships and Navigating Gatekeepers [08:09]
Mandler recounts developing relationships with artists like Rihanna and Jay-Z by seeing them beyond their public persona.
He bypassed "video commissioners" (gatekeepers) by building direct relationships with artists and decision-makers, which he acknowledges created "enemies" but was necessary to pursue his vision.
He preferred "single bids" where he could directly collaborate with artists on their vision for a song, rather than competing against multiple directors based on a diluted brief.
Mandler describes "cannibalizing" his successful photography career to focus on music videos, and later doing the same with music videos to transition into commercials and films.
He believes one must be willing to close old doors to open new opportunities and "reinvent" oneself.
He highlights the distinction between the music video industry (which was not a direct path to commercials then) and the current landscape where being a "cool music video director" is an advantage.
Iconic Music Videos and Creative Processes [26:32]
Jay-Z's "Holy Grail" is discussed as a cinematic music video.
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Collaborations with Jay-Z: "D.O.A. (Death of Auto-Tune)" and "Holy Grail" [26:32]
Mandler shares the story of directing "D.O.A. (Death of Auto-Tune)" for Jay-Z, proposing a Mexican town love story that challenged expectations.
Jay-Z's honest feedback on the initial cut of "Holy Grail" prompted Mandler to re-edit the song, starting with the chorus, which surprisingly led to radio stations playing that version.
The video explored themes of fame, isolation, and "survivor's guilt," drawing inspiration from figures like Howard Hughes and Mike Tyson.
Mandler directed 18 videos for Rihanna, noting that he "saw her for who she was in a way that other people didn't" [01:01:09].
He recounts the creation of "Disturbia" [2009], a pivotal moment where Rihanna self-funded the video to exercise creative control, pushing boundaries and defining her iconic image.
The unique visual style of "Disturbia" involved unconventional camera techniques and a "house of horrors" set, which was initially shelved by the label but became a huge success.
Mandler expresses pride in how Rihanna later redefined the makeup industry with Fenty Beauty, embodying the inclusivity and bold mentality they fostered in her visual identity.
Lana Del Rey Trilogy: "National Anthem," "Ride," and "Tropico" [55:49]
Working with Lana Del Rey, Mandler helped translate her strong character vision into cinematic narratives.
For "National Anthem," he embraced her references to JFK and Jackie O, casting A$AP Rocky, and using film techniques to create a nostalgic, artful aesthetic.
"Ride" focused on themes of "faulted youth" and identity, with Lana Del Rey showcasing her provocative and daring persona.
"Tropico" delved into biblical and Hollywood iconography, pushing stylistic boundaries and demonstrating Lana's willingness to be subversive.
Transition to Feature Films and Future of Filmmaking [01:17:55]
Anthony Mandler shares insights on the future of filmmaking.
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Mandler discusses the persistent challenges he faced in breaking into feature films despite his success in music videos and commercials, with several projects falling apart.
His first feature, "Monster" [2018], was a small independent film based on a book, where he identified with the character's journey.
He fought for Kelvin Harrison Jr. to play the lead, who later became a prolific actor.
"Surrounded" [2023] was a Western that allowed him to adapt the script to a new narrative during COVID-19, featuring strong visual elements and practical effects.
Mandler explains that directing musicians often involves using simple adjectives, while directing actors requires leading them to "take ownership" of their performance without direct "line reading."
He learned to tailor his communication style to individual actors, balancing different acting methodologies to achieve the desired performance.
Mandler expresses both fear and excitement about AI's impact on filmmaking, actively learning and stress-testing current AI capabilities.
He predicts that a significant portion of future films, especially in genres like horror and sci-fi, will be made with AI at drastically reduced budgets.
He believes that genuine human experience, curiosity, and optimism will remain crucial for creating compelling stories and maintaining relevance in an AI-dominated landscape.
